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The Rediff Business Interview/S Gurumurthy

'India cannot live in cities'

Why should we wait for a multinational corporation to build our infrastructure? Is it not the duty of our country to develop our infrastructure?

I agree. But where will the foreigner go if there is no place to invest? For him, we are a place to invest. We are crawling and standing at the airports with garlands to get foreign investment. You may get foreign investment, when they will see what a responsible group of people we are. If you yourself invest a lot in your country, you will be respected. You have to learn to respect yourself first.

But our country has failed in building the infrastructure.

The State has stopped working from 1990 in India. The State thought everything will be looked after by the private sector. Even in the most modern Western countries, public investment in infrastructure is 70 per cent, investment from private sector is only 30 per cent. Globalisation means no state, you can't have both. Globalisation means, the State will just look at what is happening.

Why is it that infrastructure was neglected so far?

Because you want to build huge cities. India cannot live in cities, India will have to develop rural infrastructure and make people stay in villages. We are doing the wrong thing. We must build 10 to 12 big cities, 100 small towns and the rest in the villages with communication, drinking water, irrigation, special methods of agriculture, etc. We should prevent the MLAs elected from having houses in cities. They should live in the place from where they are elected. Then, they will be afraid of their names being spoilt.

My being in my locality has a two-way effect. I am responsible and I am also afraid. We have to think of indigenous methods. We have all been educated in the Western language, Western idiom and Western ways of thinking.

The BJP government is also talking about MNCs and FDI. What will you do now?

I am also looking at the BJP government, trying to find what it is doing. If I feel the BJP is the cure for everything, I will be in the BJP, I will not be outside.

You were a part of the group which helped them create their manifesto.

I would like to be a part of the machinery of all parties, not only the BJP. Only the BJP consulted me. But I am not responsible for what it may do. My clients consult me. Does that mean I am responsible for their actions? They are not bound by my actions and I am not bound by my their actions.

How will you react to their policies?

I will react in the same way I react to anybody.

Earlier the Congress government and later on the UF government talked about FDI a lot. They unanimously said, whether it is computer chips or potato chips, we want FDI. What do you say about this?

To put it a little lightly, in India, Muslims, Dalits, women, and FDI all have the same political status.You can't talk against any of them without being labelled this or that. Previously we had only three, now we have a new entrant, the FDI.

Are you for FDI or against FDI?

I feel it is so insignificant, I don't even want to talk about it. In my scheme of things, FDI does not exist at all. If you get $ 40 billion FDI income, I can understand, It is something. I have no respect for these two billion dollars.

Why all of a sudden are so many political parties talking about swadeshi?

Who all are talking about swadeshi? Except the BJP, nobody is talking about it.

The Communist parties are.

They are not talking, they are only using the word swadeshi.

They are not just using the word swadeshi, but are talking against liberalisation and about protecting Indian industries.

Then I am happy.

What kind of economic policies do you expect from the BJP government?

I think they will probably try and trigger agriculture. It will take two to three years for a massive development to generate. In 10 years India will be a world power if it generates agricultural strength, if it doubles agricultural production.

I would like to ask you about the full convertibility of rupee...

Nobody is talking about it now.

Why? Is it because of the Southeast Asian crisis?

Because foolish ideas cannot be sustained for long. The whole world, in my view will rethink full convertibility because it cannot be sustained for long. I am not talking about India alone, I am talking about the whole world.

At the CII summit, the UF leaders and many others said that full convertibility was inevitable.

Now they will not talk about it, there is a deafening silence.

Do you feel it was a boon for the country that the UF government fell?

Not a boon, we escaped a disaster.

How will you react to their slogan that we want both computer chips and potato chips?

I want computer chips. I don't want to lose out on computer chips. But I can manage potato chips. Potato chips are made at home in India. I have no problem.

Are you against things like Kentucky Fried Chicken, Coke, etc coming to India?

It is not an issue at all. I will just not allow them, that's all. Why should I enter into a debate on whether they should not be in India? There is no need for a debate. Why should we debate on whether surrogate motherhood should come to India?

The media has been writing a lot about George Fernandes's desire to drive away MNCs, and, of course, Coke, from India..

The media is writing all nuts. I have no great respect for the Indian media at all though I am a part of it. I feel it is one of the most superficial media that prevails in a democracy. That is why we have an infantile democracy.

Is it because the intellectuals of India are not in the media that it is superficial?

It is because we have equated English knowledge with intellectualism. I feel there is far more depth in people who speak in their own mother tongue than the people who speak in English. But we respect only those who speak in English. This is a slavish society.

But you cannot deny the fact that English is a must for the society, especially in today's world.

A must is different from being worshipped. Toilet is very necessary, but will you do pooja there?

You said, globalisation will become a residue in the next decade and not driving force. Why did you say so?

My view is that India is a huge market. It requires a lot of effort to sustain itself. It cannot go on supplying to the world market. It needs only a marginal interaction with the world market. We are not a country like Japan or Germany whose local market is exhausted and they have to go elsewhere for market. We have an inexhaustible market. In that sense I said, globalisation will be a residue in India.

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